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Here are my questions for the Timaeus:
What similarities and differences do you see in terms of either the role of the Demiurge here, the “Craftsperson,” and other creator-gods who we have encountered, or the structure or formation of the cosmos?
First, think about how Plato conceives of the human person, the soul, its origin, and its destiny. How is Plato’s understanding of the human being similar or different to other stories which we’ve read?
Regarding the Phaedo, here is my third question:
How is the Phaedo’s understanding of the afterlife and the soul different or similar than other understandings of the afterlife we’ve seen so far? How might that affect how Plato sees how one ought to live their lives in the here and and now? I.e., what ought one to be doing with their lives?
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Timaeus 1
Plato, Timaeus – c. 360 BCE, trans. Benjamin Jowett
Consider These While Reading:
● nature of the Demiurge (Craftsman)
● Significance of the cosmos itself being a singular and spherical “living creature”
● the role of the visible heavens as an image of eternity
● role of the heavens, and the astral bodies, as objects of contemplation
● Nature of material objects
● nature and the purpose of human beings
● means of perfecting the human soul
● role of physical exercise, the senses, and human bodies
SOCRATES. And what other, Critias, can we find that will be better than this, which is natural
and suitable to the festival of the goddess, and has the very great advantage of being a fact and
not a fiction? How or where shall we find another if we abandon this? We cannot, and therefore
you must tell the tale, and good luck to you; and I in return for my yesterday’s discourse will now
rest and be a listener.
CRITIAS. Let me proceed to explain to you, Socrates, the order in which we have arranged our
entertainment. Our intention is, that Timaeus, who is the most of an astronomer amongst us,
and has made the nature of the universe his special study, should speak first, beginning with the
generation of the world and going down to the creation of man; next, I am to receive the men
whom he has created of whom some will have profited by the excellent education which you
have given them; and then, in accordance with the tale of Solon, and equally with his law, we
will bring them into court and make them citizens, as if they were those very Athenians whom
the sacred Egyptian record has recovered from oblivion, and thenceforward we will speak of
them as Athenians and fellow-citizens.
SOCRATES. I see that I shall receive in my turn a perfect and splendid feast of reason. And
now, Timaeus, you, I suppose, should speak next, after duly calling upon the Gods.
TIMAEUS. All men, Socrates, who have any degree of right feeling, at the beginning of every
enterprise, whether small or great, always call upon God. And we, too, who are going to
discourse of the nature of the universe, how created or how existing without creation, if we be
not altogether out of our wits, must invoke the aid of Gods and Goddesses and pray that our
words may be acceptable to them and consistent with themselves. Let this, then, be our
invocation of the Gods, to which I add an exhortation of myself to speak in such manner as will
be most intelligible to you, and will most accord with my own intent.
First then, in my judgment, we must make a distinction and ask, What is that which always is
and has no becoming; and what is that which is always becoming and never is? That which is
apprehended by intelligence and reason is always in the same state; but that which is conceived
Timaeus 2
by opinion with the help of sensation and without reason, is always in a process of becoming
and perishing and never really is.
Now everything that becomes or is created must of necessity be created by some cause, for
without a cause nothing can be created. The work of the creator, whenever he looks to the
unchangeable and fashions the form and nature of his work after an unchangeable pattern,
must necessarily be made fair and perfect; but when he looks to the created only, and uses a
created pattern, it is not fair or perfect.
Was the heaven then or the world, whether called by this or by any other more appropriate
name-assuming the name, I am asking a question which has to be asked at the beginning of an
enquiry about anything-was the world, I say, always in existence and without beginning? or
created, and had it a beginning? Created, I reply, being visible and tangible and having a body,
and therefore sensible; and all sensible things are apprehended by opinion and sense and are
in a process of creation and created. Now that which is created must, as we affirm, of necessity
be created by a cause.
But the father and maker of all this universe is past finding out; and even if we found him, to tell
of him to all men would be impossible. And there is still a question to be asked about him:
Which of the patterns had the artificer in view when he made the world-the pattern of the
unchangeable, or of that which is created? If the world is fair and the artificer is good, it is
manifest that he must have looked to that which is eternal; but if what cannot be said without
blasphemy is true, then to the created pattern. Every one will see that he must have looked to,
the eternal; for the world is the fairest of creations and he is the best of causes. And having
been created in this way, the world has been framed in the likeness of that which is
apprehended by reason and mind and is unchangeable, and must therefore of necessity, if this
is admitted, be a copy of something.
Now it is all-important that the beginning of everything should be according to nature. And in
speaking of the copy and the original we may assume that words are akin to the matter which
they describe; when they relate to the lasting and permanent and intelligible, they ought to be
lasting and unalterable, and, as far as their nature allows, irrefutable and immovable-nothing
less. But when they express only the copy or likeness and not the eternal things themselves,
they need only be likely and analogous to the real words. As being is to becoming, so is truth to
belief.
If then, Socrates, amid the many opinions about the gods and the generation of the universe,
we are not able to give notions which are altogether and in every respect exact and consistent
with one another, do not be surprised. Enough, if we adduce probabilities as likely as any
others; for we must remember that I who am the speaker, and you who are the judges, are only
mortal men, and we ought to accept the tale which is probable and enquire no further.
Timaeus 3
SOCRATES. Excellent, Timaeus; and we will do precisely as you bid us. The prelude is
charming, and is already accepted by us-may we beg of you to proceed to the strain?
Nature of the Demiurge (Craftsman)
TIMAEUS. Let me tell you then why the creator made this world of generation. He was good,
and the good can never have any jealousy of anything. And being free from jealousy, he desired
that all things should be as like himself as they could be. This is in the truest sense the origin of
creation and of the world, as we shall do well in believing on the testimony of wise men: God
desired that all things should be good and nothing bad, so far as this was attainable. Wherefore
also finding the whole visible sphere not at rest, but moving in an irregular and disorderly
fashion, out of disorder he brought order, considering that this was in every way better than the
other.
Creation of the Cosmos as a Spherical “Living Creature”
Now the deeds of the best could never be or have been other than the fairest; and the creator,
reflecting on the things which are by nature visible, found that no unintelligent creature taken as
a whole was fairer than the intelligent taken as a whole; and that intelligence could not be
present in anything which was devoid of soul. For which reason, when he was framing the
universe, he put intelligence in soul, and soul in body, that he might be the creator of a work
which was by nature fairest and best.
Wherefore, using the language of probability, we may say that the world became a Living
Creature truly endowed with soul and intelligence by the providence of God.
This being supposed, let us proceed to the next stage: In the likeness of what animal did the
Demiurge make the world? It would be an unworthy thing to liken it to any nature which exists
as a part only; for nothing can be beautiful which is like any imperfect thing; but let us suppose
the world to be the very image of that whole of which all other animals both individually and in
their tribes are portions.
For the original of the universe contains in itself all intelligible beings, just as this world
comprehends us and all other visible creatures. For the Deity, intending to make this world like
the fairest and most perfect of intelligible beings, framed one visible animal comprehending
within itself all other animals of a kindred nature…In order then that the world might be solitary,
like the perfect animal, the creator made not two worlds or an infinite number of them; but there
is and ever will be one only-begotten and created heaven.
Now that which is created is of necessity corporeal, and also visible and tangible. And nothing is
visible where there is no fire, or tangible which has no solidity, and nothing is solid without earth.
Wherefore also God in the beginning of creation made the body of the universe to consist of fire
and earth…And for these reasons, and out of such elements which are in number four, the body
Timaeus 4
of the world was created, and it was harmonised by proportion, and therefore has the spirit of
friendship; and having been reconciled to itself, it was indissoluble by the hand of any other than
the framer.
…For the Demiurge conceived that a being which was self-sufficient would be far more excellent
than one which lacked anything; and, as he had no need to take anything or defend himself
against any one, the Demiurge did not think it necessary to bestow upon him hands: nor had he
any need of feet, nor of the whole apparatus of walking; but the movement suited to his
spherical form was assigned to him, being of all the seven that which is most appropriate to
mind and intelligence; and he was made to move in the same manner and on the same spot,
within his own limits revolving in a circle…And as this circular movement required no feet, the
universe was created without legs and without feet.
Such was the whole plan of the eternal God about the god that was to be, to whom for this
reason he gave a body, smooth and even, having a surface in every direction equidistant from
the centre, a body entire and perfect, and formed out of perfect bodies. And in the centre he put
the soul, which he diffused throughout the body, making it also to be the exterior environment of
it; and he made the universe a circle moving in a circle, one and solitary, yet by reason of its
excellence able to converse with itself, and needing no other friendship or acquaintance. Having
these purposes in view he created the world a blessed god.
…
Now when the Demiurge had framed the soul according to his will, he formed within her the
corporeal universe, and brought the two together, and united them centre to centre. The soul,
interfused everywhere from the centre to the circumference of heaven, of which also she is the
external envelopment, herself turning in herself, began a divine beginning of never ceasing and
rational life enduring throughout all time. The body of heaven is visible, but the soul is invisible,
and partakes of reason and harmony, and being made by the best of intellectual and everlasting
natures, is the best of things created…
Demiurge’s Infusion of Time into the Cosmos as an Image of Eternity, the Rotation of the
Heavens, and the Creation of the Gods
When the father creator saw the creature which he had made moving and living, the created
image of the eternal gods, he rejoiced, and in his joy determined to make the copy still more like
the original; and as this was eternal, he sought to make the universe eternal, so far as might be.
Now the nature of the ideal being was everlasting, but to bestow this attribute in its fullness
upon a creature was impossible. Wherefore he resolved to have a moving image of eternity, and
when he set in order the heaven, he made this image eternal but moving according to number,
while eternity itself rests in unity; and this image we call time. For there were no days and nights
and months and years before the heaven was created, but when he constructed the heaven he
Timaeus 5
created them also. They are all parts of time, and the past and future are created species of
time, which we unconsciously but wrongly transfer to the eternal essence…
Time, then, and the heaven came into being at the same instant in order that, having been
created together, if ever there was to be a dissolution of them, they might be dissolved together.
It was framed after the pattern of the eternal nature, that it might resemble this as far as was
possible; for the pattern exists from eternity, and the created heaven has been, and is, and will
be, in all time. Such was the mind and thought of God in the creation of time…
…And yet there is no difficulty in seeing that the perfect number of time fulfills the perfect year
when all the eight revolutions, having their relative degrees of swiftness, are accomplished
together and attain their completion at the same time, measured by the rotation of the same and
equally moving. After this manner, and for these reasons, came into being such of the stars as
in their heavenly progress received reversals of motion, to the end that the created heaven
might imitate the eternal nature, and be as like as possible to the perfect and intelligible animal.
Thus far and until the birth of time the created universe was made in the likeness of the original,
but inasmuch as all animals were not yet comprehended therein, it was still unlike. What
remained, the creator then proceeded to fashion after the nature of the pattern. Now as in the
ideal animal the mind perceives ideas or species of a certain nature and number, he thought
that this created animal ought to have species of a like nature and number. There are four such;
one of them is the heavenly race of the gods; another, the race of birds whose way is in the air;
the third, the watery species; and the fourth, the pedestrian and land creatures. Of the heavenly
and divine, he created the greater part out of fire, that they might be the brightest of all things
and fairest to behold, and he fashioned them after the likeness of the universe in the figure of a
circle, and made them follow the intelligent motion of the supreme, distributing them over the
whole circumference of heaven, which was to be a true cosmos or glorious world spangled with
them all over…
The earth, which is our nurse, clinging around the pole which is extended through the universe,
he framed to be the guardian and artificer of night and day, first and eldest of gods that are in
the interior of heaven. Vain would be the attempt to tell all the figures of them circling as in
dance, and their juxtapositions, and the return of them in their revolutions upon themselves, and
their approximations, and to say which of these deities in their conjunctions meet, and which of
them are in opposition, and in what order they get behind and before one another, and when
they are severally eclipsed to our sight and again reappear, sending terrors and intimations of
the future to those who cannot calculate their movements-to attempt to tell of all this without a
visible representation of the heavenly system would be labour in vain. Enough on this head; and
now let what we have said about the nature of the created and visible gods have an end.
To know or tell the origin of the other divinities is beyond us, and we must accept the traditions
of the men of old time who affirm themselves to be the offspring of the gods-that is what they
Timaeus 6
say-and they must surely have known their own ancestors. How can we doubt the word of the
children of the gods?…
Oceanus and Tethys were the children of Earth and Heaven, and from these sprang Phorcys
and Cronos and Rhea, and all that generation; and from Cronos and Rhea sprang Zeus and
Here, and all those who are said to be their brethren, and others who were the children of these.
Creation of Human Beings
Now, when all of them, both those who visibly appear in their revolutions as well as those other
gods who are of a more retiring nature, had come into being, the creator of the universe
addressed them in these words:
“Gods, children of gods, who are my works, and of whom I am the artificer and father, my
creations are indissoluble, if so I will. All that is bound may be undone, but only an evil being
would wish to undo that which is harmonious and happy. Wherefore, since ye are but creatures,
ye are not altogether immortal and indissoluble, but ye shall certainly not be dissolved, nor be
liable to the fate of death, having in my will a greater and mightier bond than those with which ye
were bound at the time of your birth. And now listen to my instructions:
Three tribes of mortal beings remain to be created – without them the universe will be
incomplete, for it will not contain every kind of animal which it ought to contain, if it is to be
perfect. On the other hand, if they were created by me and received life at my hands, they
would be on an equality with the gods. In order then that they may be mortal, and that this
universe may be truly universal, do ye, according to your natures, betake yourselves to the
formation of animals, imitating the power which was shown by me in creating you.
The part of them worthy of the name immortal, which is called divine and is the guiding principle
of those who are willing to follow justice and you-of that divine part I will myself sow the seed,
and having made a beginning, I will hand the work over to you.
And do ye then inter-weave the mortal with the immortal, and make and beget living creatures,
and give them food, and make them grow, and receive them again in death.”
Thus he spake, and once more into the cup in which he had previously mingled the soul of the
universe he poured the remains of the elements, and mingled them in much the same manner;
they were not, however, pure as before, but diluted to the second and third degree. And having
made it he divided the whole mixture into souls equal in number to the stars, and assigned each
soul to a star; and having there placed them as in a chariot, he showed them the nature of the
universe, and declared to them the laws of destiny, according to which their first birth would be
one and the same for all,-no one should suffer a disadvantage at his hands; they were to be
sown in the instruments of time severally adapted to them, and to come forth the most religious
of animals; and as human nature was of two kinds, the superior race would be called man.
Timaeus 7
Now, when they should be implanted in bodies by necessity, and be always gaining or losing
some part of their bodily substance, then in the first place it would be necessary that they should
all have in them one and the same faculty of sensation, arising out of irresistible impressions; in
the second place, they must have love, in which pleasure and pain mingle; also fear and anger,
and the feelings which are akin or opposite to them; if they conquered these they would live
righteously, and if they were conquered by them, unrighteously. He who lived well during his
appointed time was to return and dwell in his native star, and there he would have a blessed
and congenial existence.
But if he failed in attaining this, at the second birth he would pass into a woman, and if, when in
that state of being, he did not desist from evil, he would continually be changed into some brute
who resembled him in the evil nature which he had acquired, and would not cease from his toils
and transformations until he followed the revolution of the same and the like within him, and
overcame by the help of reason the turbulent and irrational mob of later accretions, made up of
fire and air and water and earth, and returned to the form of his first and better state.
Having given all these laws to his creatures, that he might be guiltless of future evil in any of
them, the creator sowed some of them in the earth, and some in the moon, and some in the
other instruments of time; and when he had sown them he committed to the younger gods the
fashioning of their mortal bodies, and desired them to furnish what was still lacking to the human
soul, and having made all the suitable additions, to rule over them, and to pilot the mortal animal
in the best and wisest manner which they could, and avert from him all but self-inflicted evils.
Origins of the Conflicting Sensations in the Soul and the Importance of Philosophy
When the creator had made all these ordinances he remained in his own accustomed nature,
and his children heard and were obedient to their father’s word, and receiving from him the
immortal principle of a mortal creature, in imitation of their own creator they borrowed portions of
fire, and earth, and water, and air from the world, which were hereafter to be restored-these
they took and welded them together, not with the indissoluble chains by which they were
themselves bound, but with little pegs too small to be visible, making up out of all the four
elements each separate body, and fastening the courses of the immortal soul in a body which
was in a state of perpetual influx and efflux. Now these courses, detained as in a vast river,
neither overcame nor were overcome; but were hurrying and hurried to and fro, so that the
whole animal was moved and progressed, irregularly however and irrationally and anyhow, in all
the six directions of motion, wandering backwards and forwards, and right and left, and up and
down, and in all the six directions. For great as was the advancing and retiring flood which
provided nourishment, the affections produced by external contact caused still greater
tumult-when the body of any one met and came into collision with some external fire, or with the
solid earth or the gliding waters, or was caught in the tempest borne on the air, and the motions
produced by any of these impulses were carried through the body to the soul. All such motions
have consequently received the general name of “sensations,” which they still retain…
Timaeus 8
And by reason of all these affections, the soul, when encased in a mortal body, now, as in the
beginning, is at first without intelligence; but when the flood of growth and nutriment abates, and
the courses of the soul, calming down, go their own way and become steadier as time goes on,
then the several circles return to their natural form, and their revolutions are corrected, and they
call the same and the other by their right names, and make the possessor of them to become a
rational being.
And if these combine in him with any true nurture or education, he attains the fulness and health
of the perfect man, and escapes the worst disease of all; but if he neglects education he walks
lame to the end of his life, and returns imperfect and good for nothing to the world below. This,
however, is a later stage; at present we must treat more exactly the subject before us, which
involves a preliminary enquiry into the generation of the body and its members, and as to how
the soul was created-for what reason and by what providence of the gods; and holding fast to
probability, we must pursue our way.
Creation of the Human Head
First, then, the gods, imitating the spherical shape of the universe, enclosed the two divine
courses in a spherical body, that, namely, which we now term the head, being the most divine
part of us and the lord of all that is in us: to this the gods, when they put together the body, gave
all the other members to be servants, considering that it partook of every sort of motion…
Importance of Eyesight in Contemplating Heaven
…I will therefore now proceed to speak of the higher use and purpose for which God has given
them to us. The sight in my opinion is the source of the greatest benefit to us, for had we never
seen the stars, and the sun, and the heaven, none of the words which we have spoken about
the universe would ever have been uttered. But now the sight of day and night, and the months
and the revolutions of the years, have created number, and have given us a conception of time,
and the power of enquiring about the nature of the universe; and from this source we have
derived philosophy, than which no greater good ever was or will be given by the gods to mortal
man. This is the greatest boon of sight: and of the lesser benefits why should I speak? even the
ordinary man if he were deprived of them would bewail his loss, but in vain. Thus much let me
say however: God invented and gave us sight to the end that we might behold the courses of
intelligence in the heaven, and apply them to the courses of our own intelligence which are akin
to them, the unperturbed to the perturbed; and that we, learning them and partaking of the
natural truth of reason, might imitate the absolutely unerring courses of God and regulate our
own vagaries.
Importance of Musical Harmonies
The same may be affirmed of speech and hearing: they have been given by the gods to the
same end and for a like reason. For this is the principal end of speech, whereto it most
Timaeus 9
contributes. Moreover, so much of music as is adapted to the sound of the voice and to the
sense of hearing is granted to us for the sake of harmony; and harmony, which has motions
akin to the revolutions of our souls, is not regarded by the intelligent votary of the Muses as
given by them with a view to irrational pleasure, which is deemed to be the purpose of it in our
day, but as meant to correct any discord which may have arisen in the courses of the soul, and
to be our ally in bringing her into harmony and agreement with herself; and rhythm too was
given by them for the same reason, on account of the irregular and graceless ways which
prevail among mankind generally, and to help us against them.
Inability of Finding Truth in Transitory Elements
…Thus, then, as the several elements never present themselves in the same form, how can any
one have the assurance to assert positively that any of them, whatever it may be, is one thing
rather than another? No one can. But much the safest plan is to speak of them as
follows:-Anything which we see to be continually changing, as, for example, fire, we must not
call “this” or “that,” but rather say that it is “of such a nature”; nor let us speak of water as “this”;
but always as “such”; nor must we imply that there is any stability in any of those things which
we indicate by the use of the words “this” and “that,” supposing ourselves to signify something
thereby; for they are too volatile to be detained in any such expressions as “this,” or “that,” or
“relative to this,” or any other mode of speaking which represents them as permanent. We ought
not to apply “this” to any of them, but rather the word “such”…
Let me make another attempt to explain my meaning more clearly. Suppose a person to make
all kinds of figures of gold and to be always transmuting one form into all the rest-somebody
points to one of them and asks what it is. By far the safest and truest answer is, That is gold;
and not to call the triangle or any other figures which are formed in the gold “these,” as though
they had existence, since they are in process of change while he is making the assertion; but if
the questioner be willing to take the safe and indefinite expression, “such,” we should be
satisfied…
Proper Forming of the Soul
…And once more, when body large and too strong for the soul is united to a small and weak
intelligence, then inasmuch as there are two desires natural to man, one of food for the sake of
the body, and one of wisdom for the sake of the diviner part of us then, I say, the motions of the
stronger, getting the better and increasing their own power, but making the soul dull, and stupid,
and forgetful, engender ignorance, which is the greatest of diseases.
There is one protection against both kinds of disproportion: that we should not move the body
without the soul or the soul without the body, and thus they will be on their guard against each
other, and be healthy and well balanced. And therefore the mathematician or any one else
whose thoughts are much absorbed in some intellectual pursuit, must allow his body also to
have due exercise, and practise gymnastic; and he who is careful to fashion the body, should in
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turn impart to the soul its proper motions, and should cultivate music and all philosophy, if he
would deserve to be called truly fair and truly good.
…
Divine Nature of the Human Soul
And we should consider that God gave the sovereign part of the human soul to be the divinity of
each one, being that part which, as we say, dwells at the top of the body, inasmuch as we are a
plant not of an earthly but of a heavenly growth, raises us from earth to our kindred who are in
heaven. And in this we say truly ; for the divine power suspended the head and root of us from
that place where the generation of the soul first began, and thus made the whole body upright.
When a man is always occupied with the cravings of desire and ambition, and is eagerly striving
to satisfy them, all his thoughts must be mortal, and, as far as it is possible altogether to
become such, he must be mortal every whit, because he has cherished his mortal part.
But he who has been earnest in the love of knowledge and of true wisdom, and has exercised
his intellect more than any other part of him, must have thoughts immortal and divine, if he
attain truth, and in so far as human nature is capable of sharing in immortality, he must
altogether be immortal; and since he is ever cherishing the divine power, and has the divinity
within him in perfect order, he will be perfectly happy. Now there is only one way of taking care
of things, and this is to give to each the food and motion which are natural to it. And the motions
which are naturally akin to the divine principle within us are the thoughts and revolutions of the
universe.
These each man should follow, and correct the courses of the head which were corrupted at our
birth, and by learning the harmonies and revolutions of the universe, should assimilate the
thinking being to the thought, renewing his original nature, and having assimilated them should
attain to that perfect life which the gods have set before mankind, both for the present and the
future.
…
Animal Analogies for Different Types of Souls
…Thus were created women and the female sex in general. But the race of birds was created
out of innocent light-minded men, who, although their minds were directed toward heaven,
imagined, in their simplicity, that the clearest demonstration of the things above was to be
obtained by sight; these were remodelled and transformed into birds, and they grew feathers
instead of hair. The race of wild and pedestrian animals, again, came from those who had no
philosophy in any of their thoughts, and never considered at all about the nature of the heavens,
because they had ceased to use the courses of the head, but followed the guidance of those
parts of the soul which are in the breast.
Timaeus 11
In consequence of these habits of theirs they had their front-legs and their heads resting upon
the earth to which they were drawn by natural affinity; and the crowns of their heads were
elongated and of all sorts of shapes, into which the courses of the soul were crushed by reason
of disuse. And this was the reason why they were created quadrupeds and polypods: God gave
the more senseless of them the more support that they might be more attracted to the earth.
And the most foolish of them, who trail their bodies entirely upon the ground and have no longer
any need of feet, he made without feet to crawl upon the earth.
The fourth class were the inhabitants of the water: these were made out of the most entirely
senseless and ignorant of all, whom the transformers did not think any longer worthy of pure
respiration, because they possessed a soul which was made impure by all sorts of
transgression ; and instead of the subtle and pure medium of air, they gave them the deep and
muddy sea to be their element of respiration; and hence arose the race of fishes and oysters,
and other aquatic animals, which have received the most remote habitations as a punishment of
their outlandish ignorance. These are the laws by which animals pass into one another, now, as
ever, changing as they lose or gain wisdom and folly.
We may now say that our discourse about the nature of the universe has an end.
Summary Statement
The world has received animals, mortal and immortal, and is fulfilled with them, and has become
a visible animal containing the visible, the sensible God who is the image of the intellectual, the
greatest, best, fairest, most perfect, the one and only begotten heaven.
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greek
timaeus
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